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Beyond UX Design Podcast

⚔️ Frenemy at the gate! The great PM/UX schism with Tom Drugan

Published 27 days ago • 8 min read

As AI and economic pressures upend traditional software roles, how can Product Managers and UX Designers leverage each other’s strengths to continue to deliver exceptional user experiences?

Can Product Managers and UX Designers find common ground amidst the growing “turf war?”


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Unless you’ve been living under a rock you’ve probably seen the back-and-forth between Product Managers and UX Designers.

There has always been a sort of tension between the two roles, likely stemming from the fact that there is a decent amount of overlap between the two.

🤔 Who owns discovery?
🧐 Who owns research?
😠 Who owns feature definition?

Back when times were good, this was simply a point of contention.

Throw productivity tools like AI and economic pressures into the mix, and you’ve got a potential powder keg.

Now that times are tough, teams are downsizing, and one role is replacing the other, it’s not just a point of contention.

People’s livelihoods are on the line.

And of course, people are upset.

So it’s no surprise that I’ve seen a lot more heated debate recently than I have in a long time.

I was really interested in getting a Product Manager’s perspective on this. So I reached out to my friend Tom Drugan to get his take. Tom is the VP of Product & Operations at Slide UX down in Austin.

Tom has some interesting perspectives on this whole thing, and he’s got some fascinating insights into where we go from here, specifically how AI has brought the overlap to a boiling point.

I was intrigued by his prediction that we’ll start seeing PM and UX roles converge into a kind of “conductor” of all the things.

Much like how the record player and Excel completely upended their respective industries, AI will likely change how and what we do today. But there’s no doubt humans will still be needed for all kinds of things. It’s just a matter of what and how we work going forward.

This was a great conversation. Check out the comments for a link to the full episode.


🎯 Here are some key takeaways from our chat

1️⃣ There’s a healthy amount of ego on both sides: Acknowledge this and approach each other with empathy and humility. Don’t fall for in-group and out-group biases.

2️⃣ Embrace the convergence of PM and UX: Remember that each is just a title. There’s nothing stopping anyone from learning the skills of each role. The blending of roles can bring about more holistic and user-centered product strategies. Embrace opportunities for cross-training and collaboration.

3️⃣ Stay flexible and future-focused: Who knows what the future will hold? Keep your skills sharp and your knowledge current. Staying adaptable ensures you can handle the potential merging of roles.

4️⃣ Foster a collaborative team environment: Break down silos between PM and UX teams by promoting open communication and regular interaction. Co-designing, brainstorming, workshops, and shared goals can help build a more cohesive and aligned team.

5️⃣ Build strong interpersonal relationships: Invest time in developing strong relationships with team members across all functions. Good relationships are the backbone of effective collaboration and can often make a difference in achieving successful project outcomes.


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Learn some incredible techniques to influence your team and advance your UX career.


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🎙️ In case you missed them...

The UX Process Paradox with Rob Hamblen

Veteran designer Rob Hamblen shares his perspectives on the often-debated topic of design process. Rob posits that embracing a defined methodology enhances creativity and leads to successful outcomes.

From Doormat to Advocate with Chris Nguyen

This week, Chris Nguyen shares his journey from feeling like a doormat to becoming his own best advocate. Chris offers strategies for designers to find their voice, build influence, and drive meaningful change in their orgs.

The Great UX/PM Schism with Tom Drugan

As AI and economic pressures upend traditional software roles, how can Product Managers and UX Designers leverage each other’s strengths to continue to deliver exceptional user experiences?


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